"Like other minorities around the world, Middle Eastern Christians have been among the first to suffer whenever their nations are invaded by foreign forces or torn apart by internal conflict, and they are among the hardest-hit in times of economic hardship.
Nearly half of the 800,000 Christians who resided in Iraq before the 2003 US-led invasion of the country have fled. Scores of Christian Palestinians, like their Muslim counterparts, have been driven out of their ancestral homeland, and those who remain behind are forced to endure the physical and economic hardships of living under Israeli occupation. Tens of thousands of Lebanese have fled their country's multiple conflicts, or have left their homeland to pursue better economic opportunities. Likewise, Jordan has lost around 20 percent of its Christians, in spite of the fact that their community enjoys full legal rights and official support. "
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I'll let the readership judge that.
ReplyDeleteWhat are you advocating, VZA? Dictatorship?
ReplyDeleteV, if they were tolerated, why would they convert? And why would people not convert if they were persecuted? I could make argument either way myself, but they would just be guesses. It can't be that simple. And why were (according to you) North African Muslims more tolerant than ME ones?
ReplyDeleteWell Molly, i know what you're trying to get at, but it is just not there. read R.S.'s "painful" article below. In my studies, as well as through original sources, there are just no large "covert or else' massacres, sorry.
ReplyDeleteGoing through the entire Oxford library on ME studies in the area (which is full of original sourcing), you are just hard pressed to find these caricature atrocities. Not even the most meticulous studies originated from the region show any of what is assume - I would say, by individuals who like to make up historical fairy tales for other purposes.
No vza is just being ignorant as usual, and glossing (she probably has no idea) over the fact of democratic governments which have been quashed in the ME by Western interventionism. They read like a list and if they were put on a single scroll, would travel the expanse of a hundred foot room. It is only gross ignorance that would make a statement that "dictators" are the only way to rule in the region.
ReplyDeleteGreat post V! These are the kinds of comments that make my day in this blog: interesting, progressive and enlightening. :)
ReplyDeleteAre you advocating dictatorship, vza?
ReplyDeleteV, I truly was not trying to get at anything. They were questions, that's all.
ReplyDeleteI know they were no convert or else massacres. Why would they do they when the dhimma paid a tax. But my question still stands. Why is North Africa different?
ReplyDeleteThanks Moy, your posts are always informative and inspirational :)
ReplyDeleteOf course not.
ReplyDeletePart of the reason is that the North African Church was divided by heresies and schisms and was not as stable as the Middle Eastern Christian communities. Also, after the fall of Carthage to the Islamic armies, there was an exodus of Christians from North Africa. Many went to Sicily, for example.
ReplyDeleteMuslim rule was for the most part tolerant. I recall reading about one Islamic ruler who allowed the Franciscans to preach to the Muslim communities.
Of course, Tunisia, in particular, is noted for its relgious tolerance.
http://www.magharebia.com/cocoon/awi/xhtml1/en_GB/features/awi/reportage/2008/06/06/reportage-01
http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=ArabWorld&article=982
Freaking messages keep appearing and disappearing!
ReplyDeleteThe main reason is...they are not Jewish.
ReplyDeleteVZA, only part of your comment shows. Can you retype it? Thanks.
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<div class="js-singleCommentText">Part of the reason is that the North African Church was divided by heresies and schisms and was not as stable as the Middle Eastern Christian communities. Also, after the fall of Carthage to the Islamic armies, there was an exodus of Christians from North Africa. Many went to Sicily, for example.
Muslim rule was for the most part tolerant. I recall reading about one Islamic ruler who allowed the Franciscans to preach to the Muslim communities.
Of course, Tunisia, in particular, is noted for its relgious tolerance.
http://www.magharebia.com/cocoon/awi/xhtml1/en_GB/features/awi/reportage/2008/06/06/reportage-01
http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=ArabWorld&article=982</div>
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Part of the reason is that the North African Church was divided by heresies and schisms and was not as stable as the Middle Eastern Christian communities. Also, after the fall of Carthage to the Islamic armies, there was an exodus of Christians from North Africa. Many went to Sicily, for example.
ReplyDeleteMuslim rule was for the most part tolerant. I recall reading about one Islamic ruler who allowed the Franciscans to preach to the Muslim communities.
Of course, Tunisia, in particular, is noted for its relgious tolerance.
http://www.magharebia.com/cocoon/awi/xhtml1/en_GB/features/awi/reportage/2008/06/06/reportage-01
http://www.arabamericannews.com/news/index.php?mod=article&cat=ArabWorld&article=982
I just did, Molly. Any better?
ReplyDeleteWhat do you mean?
ReplyDeleteFreaking messages keep appearing and disappearing!
ReplyDelete------------
What you mean?
Freaking messages keep appearing and disappearing!
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What do you mean?
No, the main reason is that they are racist Zionists colonials. They do not represent the majority of the Jewish community, they never have and never will. It is the confounding of these two that is the chief deception (Zionism and Judaism), as if you were naturally Jewish means that you would murder and steal from people - that is an antisemitic caricature.
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