August 07, 2009 "Information Clearing House" -- I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy.
Earlier in the year Chiquita Brands International Inc. (formerly United Fruit) and Dole Food Co had severely criticized Zelaya for advocating an increase of 60% in Honduras’s minimum wage, claiming that the policy would cut into corporate profits. They were joined by a coalition of textile manufacturers and exporters, companies that rely on cheap labor to work in their sweatshops.
(Thanks v)
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Some things never seem to change, do they? Sorry to break the news again. First it is terrible that this happened, but was it unprecedented? No, it was business as usual, and this administration is supporting it. I do not give a damn about how much protest is taking place, nothing has changed.
ReplyDeletehere -
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv3xM3v4-rI
here is an extra bonus
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=81aJmjUK08s
v, the Honduran congress voted 124 (out of 128) that Zelaya had broken the law. Every member of Zelaya's own party voted against him. All 15 members of the Supreme Court voted to order Zelaya's arrest, including 8 members of his own party.
ReplyDeleteThis was a fight between the legislative and judicial branches on one side, and the executive branch on the other. In my view, the correct way to remove Zelaya was impeachment through the Congress. Why they didn't choose this option escapes me. What has happened in Honduras is very bad for the Honduran economy.
<span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span style="">"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence...proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it FACT, either!
<img src="http://js-kit.com/images/icon10-external-url.png"/> <span><span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span>"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence....proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it FACT, either!</span>
<img src="http://js-kit.com/images/icon10-external-url.png"/><span><span><span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span>"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence....proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it FACT, either!</span></span>
<span><span><span><span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span>"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence....proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it true! </span></span></span>
<span><span><span><span><span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span>"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence....proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it true or even probable. Sorry, but even when posing this as a questio, the writer needed a few facts to support the question. </span></span></span></span>
<span><span><span><span><span><span style="font-style: normal;"><span><span>"I recently visited Central America. Everyone I talked with there was convinced that the military coup that had overthrown the democratically-elected president of Honduras, Manuel Zelaya, had been engineered by two US companies, with CIA support. And that the US and its new president were not standing up for democracy."</span></span></span>
ReplyDeleteHuh? There is something rather important missing from this article guys....something called evidence....proof...FACTS! A very brief walk down the Left's memory lane of past coups does not constitute evidence. Because everyone the writer met is convinced does not make it true or even probable. Sorry, but even when posing this as a question, the writer needed a few facts in support of it. </span></span></span></span></span>
Mario Vargas Llosa
ReplyDeleteI might as well just repeat what I said elsewhere word for word, I just need to substitute anand/vza for the address to fleming -
ReplyDelete<span>I want you to note something, anand/vza knows better than anyone close to this what happened, that is because his government NEVER lies to them. However, there is a deeper angle, the views of the people in the region are supposed to be suspect, because they are generally unworthy of consideration, according to anand/vza. Their reply is nothing but the continuous inference of the anglo - American as well as Eurocentric view of what is taking place in Latin America (or anywhere in the world during any time period).
As "Guest" says in his post [elsewhere], all of the past of CIA involvement and US corporations is supposed to be dismissed. However, the fact remains that the issue of what took place is much more complex than the external explanations we get from corporate media. All of these pieces - the past of the country, the incursion of the IMF policy, CIA activity, the armed forces leaders being trained in the School Of The Americas with a US base planted there, the suppression of the wages for foreign corporations and Zelaya's lifting of that base infuriating the said corporations, the fear of another participatory democracy of the left rising, all work together to militate against the simple scenario presented. Anand/vza's "expertise" over all of the emerging evidence not withstanding.</span>
My recommendation is that the article referenced be read AGAIN by the detractors, because there is MORE in it than merely a walk down "memory lane" (but selective reading and quoting is par for the course from these mental indigents).
PRESENT FACTS (not past, or nonfactual) from the article -
ReplyDelete<span><span style="">"Earlier in the year Chiquita Brands International Inc. (formerly United Fruit) and Dole Food Co had severely criticized Zelaya for advocating an increase of 60% in Honduras’s minimum wage..."</span></span>
<span><span style="font-family: verdana;"><span style="">"Every multinational knows that if Honduras raises its hourly rate, the rest of Latin America and the Caribbean will have to follow."</span></span></span>
<span><span style="">"The Guardian<span style="font-style: normal;"> ran an article announcing that “two of the Honduran coup government's top advisers have close ties to the US secretary of state. One is Lanny Davis, an influential lobbyist who was a personal lawyer for President Bill Clinton and also campaigned for Hillary. . . The other hired gun for the coup government that has deep Clinton ties is (lobbyist) Bennett Ratcliff.”"</span></span></span>
<span><span style="">"DemocracyNow! <span style="font-style: normal;">broke the news that Chiquita was represented by a powerful Washington law firm, Covington & Burling LLP, and its consultant, McLarty Associates"</span></span></span>
etc., etc.
Also, there is more to this than meets the eye in the activity of the region, hence my reference to this is only the beginning -
http://www.counterpunch.org/salas08072009.html
Once again -
ReplyDeleteTHE CONSERVATIVE COUNTER-ATTACK IN LATIN AMERICA
(I would say fascist)
http://www.counterpunch.org/salas08072009.html
<span style="">"Coup leaders in Honduras and their allies continue to play for time. Washington's continuing vacillation is allowing them to exhaust this option, but so are right-wing governments in Colombia, Mexico, Panama and Peru. After all, this coup is not just about Honduras but also about left success in Latin America, of which Honduras was the weakest link. It is increasingly becoming obvious that there is no scenario under which elites in Honduras will accept Zelaya back. I do not think that they have a plan "B" on this matter and this speaks to the kind of advice they are getting from forces in the U.S. and the region. If Zelaya comes back, the Supreme Court, the Congress, the military and the church all-loose credibility and it opens the door for the social and political movements in Honduras to push for radical change that conservative forces would find more difficult to resist...."</span>
<span style="">"But Honduras is only part of the equation. Colombia's decision to accept as many as 7 new U.S. military bases (3 airbases, including Palanquero, 2 army bases, and 2 naval bases one on the Pacific and one on the Caribbean), dramatically expands the U.S. military's role in the country and throughout the region. The Pentagon has been eyeing the airbase at Palanquero with its complex infrastructure and extensive runway for some time. This is a very troubling sign that will alter the balance of forces in the region, and speaks volumes about how the Obama administration plans to respond to change in Latin America. A possible base on the Caribbean coast of Colombia would also offer the recently reactivated U.S. Fourth Fleet, a convenient harbor on the South American mainland. In short, Venezuela would be literally encircled. However, Venezuela is not the only objective. It also places the Brazilian Amazon and all its resources within striking distance of the U.S. military, as well as the much sought after Guarani watershed. After public criticism from Bachalet of Chile, Lula of Brazil and Chávez of Venezuela, Uribe refused to attend the 10 August meeting of UNASUR, the South American Union, where he would be expected to explain the presence of the U.S. bases. The meeting of the UNASUR security council was scheduled to take up the issue of the bases and Bolivia's suggestion for a unified South American response to drug trafficking. Instead, Uribe has launched his own personal diplomacy traveling to 5 different countries in the region to explain his actions. In addition, Obama's National Security Advisor James Jones is in Brazil trying to justify the U.S. position on the bases."</span>
So what is the purpose of the link Mara, to bring some supposed "balance," from a political hack (but a good novelist) who ran for office in Peru, trying mightily to enact Neoliberal policies? One who totally ignores the entire scenario of the writing of this "constitution" in the heat of death squads? Who repeats the dumb lines of the opposition about some eternal re-election process that Zelaya was supposed to be after? I fail to see this as "balance," it is just a contribution to the blast of world and international corporate media.
ReplyDeleteI suppose I could give some credence to the background of the oligarchic past of Zelaya, but not from someone who has moved to the fascist right from early leanings to the liberation of the people. I would much rather give points to Zelaya who comes originally from such a background, but was moving in the direction of the peoples will. I guess you have your reasons, want to elaborate?
My criticism still stands. Hiring a prominent law firm is not evidence two companies and the CIA helped stage the coup. Criticizing an increase in the minimum wage is not a crime nor is it proof they wanted to overthrow the government. People here in the United States criticized the increase in OUR minimum wage, too. In fact one of my neighbors is a small business owner and she was against the increase during a recession. I guess I had better keep an eye on her!
ReplyDeleteIt was a lousy article, v. You see, you latch onto anything that "proves" your poinjt of view. I am not discounting anything. All I pointed to was the absence of any proof.
I do not see a count on the comments, do you v?
ReplyDeleteI said it before: I don't agree with everything he says and does, but neither do I with Chavez. I listen to Chavez and I listen to people like Vargas Llosa. I support Lula (and so does Chavez, by the way). There is a diversity of leadership in Latin America and I hope it will remains that way.
ReplyDeleteNow back to preparing my classes.
You are in for a lot more "diversity" soon Mara, tell me how you enjoy it.
ReplyDeleteYes vza the criticism still stands, in thin air. When the firms hired are the same ones in history defending the same corporations in the past, that sends up a red flag.
ReplyDeleteThe example of protesting the minimum wage in the USA is hardly even worth mentioning. We are not talking about a country that has been weakened like Honduras and exploited, but than again you knew that, but you threw that in to really remove all doubt as to the lame nature of your criticism.
Other than that your conclusion is obviously skewed by the nature of your criticism. No one is latching on to anything, I do not practice the same processes that you do. That is why in the long run (see the history predicted before the event(s)) I have almost always hit the bulls eye, and you have had almost zero.
Poor written article. No facts. No proof. Bulls-eye! ;)
ReplyDelete<span>Fluff article. No facts. No proof. Bulls-eye! ;) </span>
ReplyDelete<ul style="margin-top: 0cm;" type="disc">
ReplyDelete<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The US Department of State had prior knowledge of the coup. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The Department of State and the US Congress funded and advised the actors and organisations in Honduras that participated in the coup. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The Pentagon trained, schooled, commanded, funded and armed the Honduran armed forces that perpetrated the coup and that continue to repress the people of Honduras by force. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The US military presence in Honduras, that occupies the Soto Cano (Palmerola) military base, authorised the coup d’etat through its tacit complicity and refusal to withdraw its support of the Honduran military involved in the coup. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The US ambassador in Tegucigalpa, Hugo Llorens, coordinated the removal from power of President Manuel Zelaya, together with Assistant Secretary of State Thomas Shannon y John Negroponte, who presently works as an advisor to Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">From the first day the coup occurred, Washington has referred to “both parties” involved and the necessity for “dialogue” to restore constitutional order, legitimising the coup leaders by regarding them as equal players instead of criminal violators of human rights and democratic principles. </span></li>
<li class="MsoNormal"><span style=" font-family: Arial;">The Department of State has refused to legally classify the events in Honduras as a “coup d’etat”, nor has it suspended or frozen its economic aid or commerce to Honduras, and has taken no measures to effectively pressure the de facto regime. </span></li>
</ul>
<span style=" font-family: Arial;">The method of circumventing the main issue, manipulating the outcome and attempting to appear as though one position has been assumed when in reality, actions demonstrate the contrary, forms part of the new Obama doctrine of “smart power”, which purports to achieve imperialist objectives without demonising the government. “Smart Power” is “the capacity to combine ‘hard power’ with ‘soft power’ to achieve a victorious strategy. ‘Smart Power’ strategically uses diplomacy, persuasion, capacity building, military power and economic and political influence, in an effective way with a political and social legitimacy.” Essentially, it’s a mix of military force with all forms of diplomacy, with an emphasis in the use of “democracy promotion” as a principal tactic to strongy influence the destiny of societies, instead of a military invasion. [Note: Beware that “smart power” places an emphasis on the use of agencies like USAID and National Endowment for Democracy (NED) to do the ‘dirty work’ of silently penetrating and infiltrating civil society organisations in order to promote a US agenda. This explains Obama’s call for an additional $320 million in “democracy promotion” funds for the 2010 budget just for use in Latin America. This is substantially a higher sum than the quantity requested and used in Latin America for “democracy promotion” by the Bush administration in its 8 years of government combined.]</span>
ReplyDeletehttp://links.org.au/node/1147
ReplyDeleteI was told today that it is the 40th anniversary of Woodstock - I think one of the messages can be summed up in this song, we need this today -
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/v/uQYDvQ1HH-E
What we really need is freedom, you first attain what is now this rare commodity by freeing your mind. I am talking about real freedom, the type that scares those "who know whats best for you" to death. They want to crush you down, tie the entire world down in the depths of a debt peonage, and its version is created all over the world.
ReplyDeleteThey want to scare you, so they cruelly take the food from a hungry childs mouth and we hear it scream and cry in agony. It is seen in the huddled form of the elderly who wonder how they will live from day to day. We are told you must do this and you must do that, and you have to do it in specific way or you lose.
The truth be told there is nothing so powerful as the people moving as a mass against this oppression, and it has to occur all over the world. But the deepest form of darkness is reserved for those who think they have something when they have nothing - chained by delusions, blinded by a deceptive light.
We need freedom, true freedom -
http://www.youtube.com/v/o-d5x-CiTUs
It is impossible to hit the bullseye when your blind vza, especially when it is self-inflicted -
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/v/2-I7JgTtX3M
I would fall for "smart power" if I could, but unfortunately, I am too smart
ReplyDeleteMara, I am a huge fan of Lula. I use to hope that America and Brazil could swap Presidents back when GW Bush was President. ;)
ReplyDeleteLula has proven to more free market and pro business than any US president since Clinton, the most real free market pro business US president since at least Ike.
Courtesy of Angry Arab:
ReplyDeleteSome 100 universities are already boycotting the Fruit of the Loom-Russell Corporation for human rights abuses in its factories abroad.
http://us.oneworld.net/article/365950-students-protest-companys-anti-union-stance