Eight Years Later
By GABRIEL KOLKO
"The United States scarcely knew what a complex disaster it was confronting when it went to war in Afghanistan on October 7, 2001. It will eventually - perhaps years from now - suffer the same fate as Alexander the Great, the British, and the now-defunct Soviet Union: defeat."
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And while we're at it.
ReplyDelete<h1><span style="">The Afghan Folly </span></h1>
<span style="">By TARIQ ALI </span>
<span>And while we're at it.
ReplyDelete<span>The Afghan Folly </span>
<span>By TARIQ ALI </span></span>
<span style="">I</span><span style="">talian, British and German soldiers are being returned from Afghanistan to their countries in coffins. Why? Through no fault of their own but because politicians of centre-right/centre-left despatched them to fight an imperial war on behalf of Washington. In Italy, to its eternal shame, Rifondazione voted to continue the Italian presence in the Hindu Kush. Die Linke in Germany was far more principled, in a country where 80 percent are not in favor, albeit ignored by mainstream politicians. In Britain and Italy, too, there are large sections of the population opposed to the war. Their voices remain unheard in the corridors of power: http://www.counterpunch.org/ali09222009.htmlBrown and Berlusconi have become blood-brothers. </span>
<span><span>And while we're at it.
ReplyDelete<span>The Afghan Folly </span>
<span>By TARIQ ALI </span></span>
<span>I</span><span>talian, British and German soldiers are being returned from Afghanistan to their countries in coffins. Why? Through no fault of their own but because politicians of centre-right/centre-left despatched them to fight an imperial war on behalf of Washington. In Italy, to its eternal shame, Rifondazione voted to continue the Italian presence in the Hindu Kush. Die Linke in Germany was far more principled, in a country where 80 percent are not in favor, albeit ignored by mainstream politicians. In Britain and Italy, too, there are large sections of the population opposed to the war. Their voices remain unheard in the corridors of power: and Berlusconi have become blood-brothers.</span></span>
http://www.counterpunch.org/ali09222009.html
TGIA, Tariq supports violent attacks against the ANA and ANP. The ANA is by far the most beloved and respected institution among Afghans.
ReplyDeleteTariq wants to see the ANA killed. He is also campainging his hardest to cut off all funding, equipping and training for the ANA. Many Pakistanis see the ANA as a threat to them.
I would ask GABRIEL KOLKO three questions; "can you name one example where an ANA company ran from battle?" Can you name one battle the ANA has lost at the company level? If you cannot, then why do you think the ANA will lose this war?
My biggest concern about Afghanistan is as follows:
-GIRoA annual revenue = $600 million
-GIRoA annual steady state expenditure = $6,000 million or more
-Afghanistan's annual revenue is substantially less than even its education budget.
Many people such as Tariq Ali, GABRIEL KOLKO, and others are vigorously campaigning to cut off all foreign aid to Afghanistan. If that happens, the vast majority of schools, hospitals, health clinics, electricity plants would shut down immediately. The road construction would stop. Most of the ANA and ANP would be laid off. Most government employees would be laid off. Just imagine the human disaster that would follow.
Another question for GABRIEL KOLKO: "Why have between 5 people moved to Afghanistan since 2001 if Afghanistan's economy wasn't improving? Many Pakistanis moved to Afghanistan to escape the Pakistani civil war; but even accounting for that, it is an amazing success.
How many Arab armies can fight as good as the ANA? Maybe this is one reason Tariq Ali is so scared and jeolous of the ANA.
ReplyDelete<span>How many Arab armies can fight as good as the ANA? Maybe this is one reason Tariq Ali is so scared and jeolous of the ANA.</span>
ReplyDelete---------
Is that really the point?
Yes it is. TGIA, we need to think analytically even if it makes our head hurt.
ReplyDeleteIn the 2.9.09 Afghan poll, 91% of Afghans had an unfavorable view of Pakistanis. Many ISI and Pakistani Army are deeply suspicious of the Afghan National Army. There is no getting around this. This is why many are trying to block funding, training and equipping for the ANA.
The ANA is at a tipping point. Its capabilities are starting to surge. Many find this threatening. Hence the surge in foreign fighters fighting the ANA in Afghanistan.
Read this (albeit from an ANA trainer so he might be biased):
http://afghanquest.com/?p=374
Some of it so reminds me of V, it is uncanny. Next comment:
Required reading for V and one of the true causes of the "Ugly American Syndrome":
ReplyDelete"I was recently thanked by a foreign officer for something I said to a group of American officers. I told the American officers that the rest of the world views us as the big fat rich kid on the world playground. We want everyone to like us, and are heartbroken to discover that a few don’t. We are easily aroused and like to throw our weight around. <span style="text-decoration: underline;">We think that what we think is going to be the most important thing on everyone’s agenda.</span> We are not afraid to fight, and we have heavy hands. God help you if we catch you with a punch; few can withstand a beating from us. But, we are clumsy. We can be hurt, and we have no stamina; no real will. If we can be made to bleed a little, and if we can be run in circles for more than a little while, we tire easily. We have the propensity, when things get tough and we get a little winded, to take our ball and go home. We are prone to quitting. We have quit before, and we are more than likely to quit again. The Taliban know that, and the Afghan people know that. It is part of the insurgent song to the people, a message designed to keep them on the fence, unsure of which way best suits their interests. If they commit to the government being helped the by the fat kid, and the fat kid runs away to mope, they can die. Many dare not commit. Many who have committed in the last eight years have paid the price with their lives as we have moved into an area, cleared it out and announced that the bad times were over."
I love America, but we Americans are often seriously messed up. I mean left and right. Amy Goodman and Anne Coulter (both pretentious pricks.) For more on why so many foreigners don't like us:
ReplyDelete"We are world famous for abandoning those who we had told, “We will not abandon you.”
The foreign officer thanked me for saying what all of the Coalition and Afghan partners were thinking. They were afraid to raise the point, though; because we can be an ill-tempered lot when our assumptions about ourselves are challenged. To those men, it just isn’t worth it to hold up their mirror for us to look at. It’s like when someone who really doesn’t care about you lets you walk around with spinach in your teeth.
"
TGIA, if the Haqqani and Taliban and their Al Qaeda linked allies win, can you imagine the catastrophe. Pakistani Nukes in Al Qaeda hands. Moscow and Calcutta going up in smoke. Beijing's 9/11. New massacres of the Shia that make Iraq look like a snack. This is the world that awaits us if the ANA and ANP and NDS are allowed to lose.
ReplyDeleteAt precisely this time, so many want to cut off all funding and training and equipping for them? Mental insanity or what?
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;">"The United States has invested over $10 billion to develop the ANA since 2002. However, only 2 of 105 army units are assessed as being fully capable of conducting their primary mission"</span>
ReplyDelete<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;"> </span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;">"Since 2002, the United States has provided about $6.2 billion to train and equip the Afghan National Police (ANP). However, as of April 2008, no police unit was assessed as fully capable of performing its mission."</span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;"> </span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;">http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d08661.pdf</span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana;"> </span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana; mso-ansi-language: EN;">“Obama's timeline for expanding the Afghan army and police may be unrealistic, given how little progress they've made so far… The Afghan government and its international partners are having enormous difficulties filling ANA and ANP ranks with soldiers and police officers – even under its previously longer timeline. In fact, force levels in the ANP have remained virtually stagnant over the past two years, increasing very modestly from 62,000 to 76,000.” <span style="mso-spacerun: yes;"> </span></span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana; mso-ansi-language: EN;"> </span>
<p style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt;"><span style=" color: black; font-family: Verdana; mso-ansi-language: EN-AU;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2009/mar/27/obama-afghanistan-security-forces</span></span>
I hope they break the back of the American "empire" so it withers like a dying snake in the desert
ReplyDeleteThis author lied. My friend wrote this:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2009/09/afghan_national_army_3.php
http://www.longwarjournal.org/oob/afghanistan/index.php
Feel free to ask him any questions you want.
Would you like to chat with people who actually trained or embedded with the ANA?
I have a more recent update on the ANSF. The ANA currently has 131 battalion type units. Of these 58 are CM1, the highest rating classification.
The reason the ANA and ANP are so small is because the ANA and ANP are severely starved of funding. As a result they can only hire a small fraction of the Afghans who want to join them. Obama promised to find them some funding when he was elected. If the Messiah betrays them now . . . then I will be very dissipointed with him.
On the ANP, until November, 2006, the US didn't involve itself significantly with training, equipping or funding the ANP. The ANP basically started from scratch in 2007. However, it wasn't until 2009 that Obama started sending them significant funding, training and equipping. You cannot expect a national police force to form in a couple months. Afghanistan, a country of 33 million people, only had 3,000 trained police at the begining of 2008.
R.S. you can look up the exact US funding for Afghanistan by type in the 1230 Section report.
anan
ReplyDelete<span style="">Look up Gen. McChrystal's assessment of the current status of war against the Taliban . I was suggested to me by Jemmy Hope</span>
.It's a disaster.
"The reason the ANA and ANP are so small" anand
ReplyDeleteMoral is low, recruitment levels are low, and those who do join are likely to either desert, or to use their positions to help the resistance.
The current issue is that the ANA and ANP are far too small for a country of Afghanistan's size. As a result there are large parts of the country with little ANA and ANP presence.
ReplyDeleteIt takes any country, including the US, 4 years or so to expand their army. McChrystal is pointing out this gap over the next few years in security force presence.
What I think is going on is that McChystal wants sufficient ISAF forces to partner with the ANA and ANP at every level to improve Afghan security in the short term (before the US congressional and presidential election.) My own view is that the war need not be won that quickly. One of McChrystal's peaves is that many ANA and ANP are not partnered with ISAF (because the ISAF is too small to spare troops to partner with most ANA and ANP.) This means that the ANA and ANP are not improving and professionalizing as fast as they could, since they have no professional organization to learn from.
McChyrstal wants to expand the ANa and ANP at an extremely fast pace in a country that is 90% illiterate. The only way to expand it quickly is to increase the number of internaional trainers, and embedded advisors. McChrystal is going further; he wants ISAF units to partner and fight joint with ANA and ANP. This process quickly improved the quality of the IA and IP in Iraq and he wants to replicate it in Afghanistan.
r.s. The ANA and ANP are flooded with highly motivated volunteers. The problem to date has been that the ANA and ANP are forced to turn most volunteers away because of a funding shortage. McChrystal is requesting that Obama pay for the ANA and ANP to hire a larger percentage of volunteers who want to join them. Obama has not yet decided to do this. Biden apparently wants a smaller ANA and ANP to save US taxpayers money. Rumsfeld and Cheney use to support a tiny ANA and ANP so that Afghans and other foreigners could pay for it out of their own dime.
ReplyDeleteThe ANA in particular are highly motivated and are interested in fighting the Taliban. There are many combat advisors and combat trainers for the ANA that you can ask questions to. Moral is remarkably high among the ANA.
Do you have any evidence that the ANA is not loyal to the chain of command and the country? I have not seen it. The advisors of the ANA that I have spoken to tell me that the soldiers in the ANA that they worked with are as commited to fight the Taliban as any that Afghanistan could ever have. The issue, isn't motivation or morale, but professionalism and capacity. I lay much of the blame for this on the international community and its substandard training that many countries provided. Different countries train ANSF differently, making it difficult for different ANSF to work together.
R.S. the AWOL numbers (number who desert) for the ANA is very low. They are publicly published.
ReplyDeleteI have never heard about Taliban infiltration being a problem with the ANA. You would have to prove that. You need to understand the extent to which the ANA wants to fight the Taliban.
In the Feb 9, 2009 Afghan public opinion poll, 91% of all Afghans had an unfavorable view of the Taliban. By contrast the popularity of the ANA was off the charts. Among the ANA, anger at the Taliban is much higher than it is among ordinary Afghans. Why else would an Afghan want to join the ANA?
There are many websites run by people who have trained or do train the ANA and ANP.
ReplyDeleteOne of them is by a Canadian who was an embedded advisor with the 1st Bde, 205th ANA Corps in Kandahar until this spring:
http://www.snappingturtle.net/flit/
There are many more websites. Does anyone here have any interest in the ANSF?
Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva, who referred in his speech to the "absurd doctrine that markets could regulate themselves," broke with the U.S. by later saying Ahmadinejad would visit Brazil in November to discuss enhanced trade and cooperation in the two countries' oil industries. Lula said he plans to visit Tehran sometime early next year. Lula said Ahmadinejad assured him that Iran was developing its nuclear industry for peaceful, civilian uses and he has so far seen no evidence it was evading international norms.
ReplyDeleteMara, I hope you are right. A recent US gov't report suggests that Iran hasn't yet decided to build a nuclear device.
ReplyDeleteIf a deal can be reached on the nuclear issue, this paves the way for Iran to play a large role in training and equipping the ANA and ANP, which I strongly support.
<h1>Barack Obama's war: Afghanistan's failing army</h1>
ReplyDelete<p>As Barack Obama announces more US troops to train the Afghanistan army, John D McHugh reports on how US soldiers view their Afghan counterparts as ill-disciplined, badly led and with a crippling taste for hashish
<p>
<p>http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2009/mar/27/obama-afghanistan-military
Barack Obama's war: Afghanistan's failing army
ReplyDeleteAs Barack Obama announces more US troops to train the Afghanistan army, John D McHugh reports on how US soldiers view their Afghan counterparts as ill-disciplined, badly led and with a crippling taste for hashish
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/video/2009/mar/27/obama-afghanistan-military
Some people e-mailed me this. Ask yourself what specific units they were. The ANA has some good quality units (203rd ANA Corps) and bad quality units (Italian and Spanish trained 207th ANA Corps.)
ReplyDeleteAfghans in general have a huge hashish adiction problem. {All Afghans, GIRoA employees, NGO empoyees, private sector employees, organized crime people, Taliban.} It is one of the issues that it is keeping the nation so poor.
Maybe some detox course should be given to many millions of Afghans. The problem is that many Afghans like being addicted and don't want to quit. I don't have easy solutions to this problem.
The video proves that the Afghan army is a fail army 99%. All the real men have joined the resistance to drive out the invaders the Afghan army are the misfits.
ReplyDeleter.s. look at any of the more than 20 public opinion polls since 2001 taken in Afghanistan. The Taliban is viewed unfavorably by 91% of Afghans in the Feb 9, 2009 public opinion poll. In every poll, the popularity of the ANA is off the charts.
ReplyDeleter.s. do you have any real interest in the ANA? Would you like to interact directly with people who have actually lived with the ANA for months at a time. If so, I would put you in touch with actual embedded ANA adisors and journalists who have that experience. The ANA has plenty of problems. Some units (like the Italian and Spanish trained 207th ANA might even be junk.) This said, so are most of the Quetta Shura Taliban's forces (the Haqqani guys are signficantly better quality.) Or else why hasn't the Quetta Shura Taliban ever defeated the ANA in a battalion sized engagement? For that matter, R.S. can you mention one example of a company sized engagement loss by the ANA in the last year.
I only know of one example from more than a year ago.
What does this say about the quality of the Quetta Shura Taliban forces?
The example of the ANA losing a company sized engagement (the Poles fighting also became combat ineffective after suffering casualties) was ultimately won by a small number of Georgian national guards. But it was close to the border. I don't know this for sure, but the fighters might have been Haqqani Pakistani fighters (many of whom are very good quality, having killed large numbers of the Pakistani Army and the Indian Army in Kashmir.) Many of the Haqqani fighters are retired Pakistani Army, which accounts for why they fight so darn well.
ReplyDeleteAll the battles that killed many ANA or US or French or other coalition troops to my knowledge involved Haqqani fighters. {Many Chechans and Uzbechs fight for him too. Many of them have experience fighting the Russian army.}
"The Taliban is viewed unfavorably by 91% of Afghans in the Feb 9, 2009 public opinion poll."
ReplyDeleteRespondents were probably too afraid to admit the truth so their homes don't get "accidentally" wiped out during the next round of air strikes.
How many air strikes do you know about in the last two years that didn't involve tactical air support for ANA, ANP or ISAF that were under attack from the Taliban and their allies? For that matter, how many civilians do the Taliban kill? How many do pro GIRoA forces kill?
ReplyDeleteI think what you are really alleging is that the ANA and ANP are intimidating Afghan civilians. With the ANA you are off base. No evidence that I am aware.
For that matter the ANA and ISAF don't have the power to enter people's home and arrest people. Only the ANP have that power. So perhaps you mean that the ANP are abusing people. This is not doubt true to some degree.
Most ANP are completely untrained. In fact, only 20% of ANP are trained and have ORA levels 1,2 or 3. By contrast, two thirds of the ANA is at ORA levels 1 or 2. The comparable number for the ANP for ORA levels 1 and 2 is less than 10%. Big problem. However Obama has decided to train and pay for the ANP (at least until a week ago.)
Germany was in charge of the ANP during the Bush administration. Many Europeans are not smart. Look at the resident European, Jemmy.
He's smarter than you shit head.
ReplyDeleteYou remind me of a song, Onan -
ReplyDelete"Desperado, you've been bullshitting for too long ... "
Your increasingly shrill rants in support of the political cadaver, Karzai, are becoming embarrassing. People are wondering when the men in white coats will come to gently lead you away.
You called me racist you sack of filth, and you still haven't retacted your libel. If you don't do so quickly I WILL get racist on you, you wheat-complexioned coolie. (Don't all South Asian racists describe themselves as "wheat-complexioned? Sad really)